Maybe you’ve inherited an old safe, found one in a new house, or been offered one for nothing. Either way, it’s heavier than it looks. Before anyone drills, drags or scraps it, here’s what to do, in order: identify it, date it, judge its worth, then move, open, sell or donate it safely.
The short answer
- 1 Leave it where it is. Do not try to lift, tip or drill it.
- 2 Photograph the maker’s plate, every number on the door edge and lock, the key if you have one, and the whole safe.
- 3 Measure the outside: height, width and depth. This is your best guide to its weight.
- 4 Identify the maker and date it from the plate, address, serial number and lock.
- 5 Locked with no key? Call a qualified safe engineer, not a drill.
- 6 Only then decide whether to keep, sell, donate or scrap it (see how to move or get rid of an old safe), and get a written quote from a specialist safe remover for any move.
3 cwt
about 150 kg: Chubb’s 1875 minimum for a small 22-inch safe
25 kg
HSE’s highest lifting guideline for a man, load held close to the body
1819
start of Chubb’s surviving lock and safe registers
2000
safes made before this should be checked for asbestos
In This Article
Before you do anything: what to record
Most questions about an old safe, from its age to its weight, can be answered from a few photographs and a tape measure. Readers who write to us usually know the maker’s name and not much else, which is at least a start. Collect these first:
| Maker’s plate | Every word, including the town, street address and any royal arms, medal or exhibition wording. Look inside the door too. |
| Numbers | Serial numbers on the door edge, the top bolt, the lock cover and the key. Note which number is where. |
| Lock and key | Keyhole or dial, the name on the lock, the shape of the key. |
| Size | Outside height, width and depth, with the door shut. |
| Where it stands | Which floor, what the floor is made of, steps and door widths on the way out. |
| Paperwork | Receipts, invoices, service labels, old keys in envelopes, family letters. |
Paperwork is worth a search. One reader who inherited a Milner safe from his grandparents’ house also found the original receipt, dated April 1949: better dating evidence than any plate or number.
Step 1: identify the maker
The maker’s name is normally on a cast brass plate, a painted transfer or an escutcheon around the keyhole, often with a town and street. In 1875 George Hayter Chubb named the five best-known British makers as Milner, Tann, Hobbs, Chatwood and Chubb, adding that there were “many other makers” whose names appear in the patent lists.1 Many smaller firms also put their names on safes, such as Arthur H. Moss of Gornal near Dudley, whose plate is shown here.
Don’t take the plate entirely at its word, though. It doesn’t always name the factory: some name an agent or retailer, and John Tann, for example, sold through agents in Sydney, Adelaide and Brisbane.2 So a safe in Australia, India or Malaysia with a local name on it may still be British-made. Look for a second plate or a name on the lock.
Our maker entries explain what each firm’s plates and badges look like. Start with the names owners ask about most: Milner safes and the “212” badge, Chubb safes and their lock numbers, John Tann’s Reliance safes, Chatwood and Chatwood-Milner, Ratner and, for French safes, Fichet and Bauche. Other firms are added to our safe makers section as we research them.
Step 2: work out how old it is
Few safe makers published serial registers, so you’ll be putting several clues together. A plate’s wording and address often narrow the date to a few decades: the Chubb plate shown here names the company as incorporated in 1882 and the head office it occupied from 1877 until it was bombed in 1941, so the safe was made between 1882 and 1941.34
Three clues do most of the work. Our step-by-step guide on how to date an old safe covers each of them in detail.
Clue 1
Name and address
Firms changed their names and moved offices. “Milners’ Safe Co. Ltd” means 1874 or later; John Tann’s 117 Newgate Street address, 1912 or later.56
Clue 2
Serial numbers
Look on the door edge and the bolts. On many Tann safes the number is stamped into the top moving bolt; a number cast inside the door is usually a casting number.2
Dating clues by maker
| Milner | “Milner & Son” before 1874, “Milners’ Safe Co. Ltd” from 1874, “Chatwood-Milner” from 1956. No public serial register, but collectors have dated sample numbers.59 |
| Chubb | “Chubb & Son” before the 1882 incorporation, “Chubb & Son’s Lock & Safe Co. Ltd” after. Lock serial numbers ran until 1936.10311 |
| John Tann | The firm’s record books reportedly went astray, so dating relies on the address, the “List” grade and collectors’ serial examples.1213 |
| Fichet / Bauche | One name alone: before the 1967 merger. “Fichet-Bauche”: 1967 or later.14 |
Did you know?
The makers’ own registers survive. The London Archives hold Chubb’s lock and safe number registers from 1819, plus the lock and key registers of Milner’s Safe Co. (1857–1954) and the lock and safe registers of the Chatwood Safe Co. (1864–1956). The catalogue calls them “of particular value for dating locks and safes”.15 For Chubb locks, the Chubb Archive will look up a number on request.8
One trap is easy to fall into. A paper label inside the door showing the Great Exhibition of 1851 doesn’t mean the safe was made in 1851. Milner used the Exhibition in its advertising for decades, so the label only tells you the safe is from after 1851.7
Step 3: is it worth anything?
This is the question owners ask most, and the honest answer is: it depends, and often less than people hope. Collectors on the antique-locks.com forum have noted that ordinary old safes often fetch little at British auctions, while restored ones can ask far more from dealers.13 We don’t give valuations, because the factors below can only be judged by someone who sees the safe. For real sale prices by type, see our guide to what old safes are worth. What raises or lowers interest:
- Maker and age. A known maker, an early date and a documented history (receipts, an original owner) add interest.
- Original finish. Original paint, gilt lining, painted panels and clean brass plates matter more than shine. A fresh repaint can hide repairs, as George Hayter Chubb warned buyers in 1875.1
- A working lock and its keys. A safe that locks and opens with its own key is far easier to sell than one that has been drilled.
- Size and weight. Every buyer has to pay to move it. For a large safe the removal can cost more than the safe itself.
- Use today. An antique safe carries no modern burglary grade, so it will not be accepted by an insurer as a rated safe.
Anything we say about value is an informal view, not a professional appraisal. For a valuation, ask an auction house or antiques dealer who can inspect the safe.
Step 4: moving it safely
Old safes are much heavier than they look. In 1875 Chubb told buyers that a good safe only 22 by 17 by 16 inches should weigh about 3 hundredweight, roughly 150 kg, and that larger ones ran to over 2 tonnes.1 Readers regularly describe safes they estimate at 200 kg or more, wedged into understairs cupboards and bedroom wardrobes.
For comparison, the UK Health and Safety Executive’s guideline filter for lifting is 25 kg for a man and 16 kg for a woman, and that only for a load held close to the body between knuckle and elbow height.16 A safe is many times that, top-heavy when tilted, and dangerous on stairs. Even a safe manufacturer advises: “Your best bet is to have a professional safe mover do the job for you.”17
Measure the outside and compare it with the sourced weights in our guide to how much an old safe weighs, which also covers floors, stairs and how professionals do it. Our safe weight calculator gives a quick estimate from the outside size. Then ask a specialist safe removal firm for a written quote that covers access, floor protection and insurance. Empty the safe first if it’s open.
Step 5: no key or no combination
A locked safe with no key is common, and it’s rarely a reason to drill. Our guide for anyone locked out of an old safe covers costs and who to call. Ireland’s Health and Safety Authority, writing about the asbestos risk in old safes, makes the point plainly:18
“Most safes that are fitted with a mechanical lock can be opened by an expert technician without resorting to drilling.”
Health and Safety Authority (Ireland), 2023
- Call a safe engineer, not a general locksmith or a handyman. Look for members of a trade body such as the Master Locksmiths Association in the UK, the Safe & Vault Technicians Association or the Master Locksmiths Association of Australasia.19
- Expect to prove the safe is yours. A reputable engineer will ask, so have documents ready, such as the house purchase papers or the will that left it to you.
- Never drill, cut or grind it yourself. It ruins the lock and most of the value, and a pre-2000 safe may contain asbestos (see below).
- Note the numbers first. A number on the lock or an old key helps the engineer and, for Chubb, can date the lock.8 More on how old safe locks work in our history of safe lock mechanisms.
Step 6: keep, sell, donate or scrap
Keeping it is a perfectly respectable choice. Many old safes simply stay where they are: a house sale can include one, and some buyers are glad of it. If yours has to go, there are three routes.
Sell
To a dealer or at auction
Reconditioned-safe dealers, general auctions and specialist collectors. Give buyers the photos, size and access details up front, since collection is their main cost.
Donate
To a museum or society
Local museums, heritage railways and historic buildings sometimes want a safe with a local story. Offer the history and photos first; few can collect a heavy object themselves.
A reader in Malaysia told us about three safes in a small town, two of them almost floor-to-ceiling, whose owner was planning to throw them away. In a case like that, photograph the plates and numbers before anything happens, and contact a local museum or heritage group: tall safes of that kind are part of a town’s commercial history, and the plates alone can be enough to identify the maker.
Selling an old safe that may contain asbestos can also be restricted. In Ireland the authority states that the EU-wide ban on selling asbestos-containing products applies to second-hand and refurbished safes presumed to contain it.18 Rules differ between countries, so check locally before you advertise.
Safety: asbestos in old safes
Victorian fire-resisting safes were mostly filling. A typical body and door were about four inches thick, but only about half an inch of that was metal: the rest was loose fire-resisting compound between the outer and inner skins.21 Later safes and fire cabinets used other materials, and some of them contained asbestos.
Ireland’s Health and Safety Authority says asbestos was used by some safe makers “into the late 1990s”, as woven door seals and as packing sealed inside doors and walls, and advises checking any safe or fire cabinet made before 2000.18 Its guidance, which is the clearest we’ve found, comes down to four points (more in our guide: do old safes contain asbestos?):
- Sealed-in filling is not a risk in normal use, and a safe presumed to contain asbestos can still be used.
- If filling is escaping, take the safe out of use and leave it undisturbed until an asbestos consultant has tested it.
- On a safe presumed to contain asbestos, destructive cutting must not be done, and even precision drilling should be done only by a safe technician working with an asbestos contractor.
- Where the maker cannot confirm the safe is asbestos-free, presume that it contains asbestos.
Myths about old safes
A locked safe with no key has to be drilled open.
Most mechanical-lock safes can be opened by an expert without drilling.
An 1851 Great Exhibition label means the safe was made in 1851.
Makers advertised the Exhibition for decades; the label only shows a later date.
“212” on a Milner safe is its model number.
It is 212°F, the boiling point of water, Milner’s fire-resistance claim.
Every antique safe is valuable.
Ordinary old safes often sell for little; condition, maker and moving cost decide.
Ask us
Not sure who made your safe or how old it is? Send us photos of your safe’s plate and serial number and we’ll tell you what we can about its maker and date. We don’t value safes or open them, but confirmed examples help us build better dating tables for every owner.
Frequently asked questions
How do I identify an old safe?
Start with the maker’s plate or transfer, then the address on it, the serial numbers on the door edge and bolts, and the name and number on the lock. Our maker entries show what to look for on Milner, Chubb, Tann and Fichet safes.
How old is my safe?
Combine the name and address on the plate with the serial and lock numbers. For Chubb locks the Chubb Archive can give an exact date; for Milner and Tann, collectors’ serial examples give an approximate one.
How much is my old safe worth?
It depends on the maker, age, condition, original paint, a working lock with keys, and what it’ll cost to move. Ordinary old safes often sell for little, so for a real figure, ask an auction house or dealer to see it.
I have lost the key to my old safe. What can I do?
Call a qualified safe engineer with proof that the safe is yours. Most mechanical locks can be opened without drilling, and the engineer can then advise on a new key or lock.
How much does an old safe weigh?
Far more than it looks: about 150 kg for a small 22-inch Victorian safe by Chubb’s 1875 guide, and up to two tonnes or more for large double-door safes. See our weight guide for sourced examples by size.
Where can I sell an old safe?
Reconditioned-safe dealers, general and specialist auctions, and collectors. Check first whether the safe may contain asbestos, which can restrict a sale in some countries.
Sources:
- George Hayter Chubb, Protection from Fire and Thieves (London, 1875), ch. III (safes of the principal makers) and ch. V (“Second-hand safes”, weights of good safes), via Project Gutenberg. ↩︎
- antique-locks.com forum, “Accidental collector chasing info” (reply by safeman, 25 June 2016). ↩︎
- The Chubb Archive (History of Locks Museum), “Chubb 1818–1990s”. ↩︎
- The Chubb Archive, “Early sales, offices, Chubb Group, 1980s and on”. ↩︎
- Grace’s Guide, “Milners Safe Co”. ↩︎
- safeman.org.uk, “Edward Tann & Sons: the story of Britain’s first safemaker”. ↩︎
- safeman.org.uk, “Safe scrapbook”. ↩︎
- The Chubb Archive, “Registers” and lock registers 1819–1936 (entries by serial number and date). ↩︎
- antique-locks.com forum, dating Milner safes by serial number. ↩︎
- Grace’s Guide, “Chubb and Son”. ↩︎
- The Chubb Archive, “Post 1936 locks”. ↩︎
- antique-locks.com forum, “Tann’s Reliance safe, more information please” (reply by safeman, 18 October 2007). ↩︎
- antique-locks.com forum, “Tann Defiance age?” (2009) and “Help with two John Tann safes” (2018). ↩︎
- Wikipédia (French), “Fichet-Bauche”, used as a pointer to the company’s own timeline. ↩︎
- AIM25 / The London Archives, “Chubb and Son Limited, locksmiths and safe manufacturers”, ref. CLC/B/002, including the records of Milner’s Safe Co. (CLC/B/002/ML) and Chatwood Safe Co. (CLC/B/002/CH). ↩︎
- Health and Safety Executive, Manual handling at work: a brief guide, INDG143 (rev. 4, 2020), figure 1, “Lifting and lowering risk filter”. ↩︎
- Liberty Safe, “How to get a safe upstairs” (12 May 2020). A safe manufacturer’s guidance. ↩︎
- Health and Safety Authority (Ireland), “Asbestos risks in safes and fire resistant cabinets” (information note, updated September 2023). ↩︎
- Trade bodies: Master Locksmiths Association (UK), Safe & Vault Technicians Association (US and international), Master Locksmiths Association of Australasia. ↩︎
- Scrap Metal Dealers Act 2013, section 11 (verification of supplier’s identity) and section 12 (offence of buying scrap metal for cash), legislation.gov.uk. ↩︎
- safeman.org.uk, “About safes”. ↩︎
